Being a Gay Christian
Here are my struggles to reconcile my religion & sexual orientation. I used to think that being a Christian and being gay were mutually exclusive. God revealed to me that I am his child, created Just As I Am. God’s awesome gift comes with challenges, yet opportunities to share the good news to many who have rejected religion. Or who have suppressed their sexuality to keep their religion. I welcome this ministry and the unbelievable strength he gives me to do it.
About Me
- Name: Scott
I'm gay and while that does tell you which gender I want to fall in love with, it tells you nothing about my lifestyle. As you read you'll learn about that.
Thursday, May 05, 2011
"How many more gay people does God have to create before we ask ourselves whether or not God actually wants them around?" Rep. Steve Simon of Minnesota asked.
Wednesday, April 13, 2011
Go Unto All the Lands...
I am not against proselytizing, per se, but when it becomes a judgemental assault on another individual, I believe it has drastically crossed the line.
Many religions, including Christianity, have a violent period in their history when evangelism looked a lot like open warfare, even masacre. Too many innocents were given the choice of repenting and/or dying, and many were not even given a choice. Of course today we are much more civilized, right?
Sadly, the bully apostle is still at work, though somewhat less lethal in most cases.
I am all for the free exchange of ideas. I enjoy discussing religious ideas and reading various authors as part of my meditations. I don't mind when I am challenged by an idea I may not agree with for it gives me a chance to listen to God's wisdom.
As a person who is trying to live an authentic life consistent with my values and morals, I have been on the receiving end of some rather unpleasant judgement and proselytizing. I am at a point in my life where I will not back away from a challenge, nor will I return to the energy-sapping shame that I suffered from during much of my life.
But I more offended now when I see others suffering what some have called "Bible abuse" or I have thought of as "Attack of the Pharasees 2011."
This takes so many forms from physical assault to hell-fire sermons to the perverse interpretation of hating the sin but loving the sinner.
Today I was checking my blood pressure at work. Next to the room with the BP machine is an empty room set aside for personal meditation including an accomodation to the many Muslims who work with us and whose faith requires frequent periods of kneeling prayer.
While I admire those who practice their convictions, I was deeply offended by what I saw as a mean-spirited, intolerant assault on Muslims.
On the floor of the room was a pile of Christian tracts from one of the fundamental churches where I live. To me this was no different than a Shia yelling condemnation in a Catholic church service or someone replacing the cross on an altar with a Star of David.
It was crass, disrespectful and just patently offensive. In other words, a direct assault on someone's faith.
This is not the first time I have found and reported such literature, but the first time I saw it in a place specifically set aside for people to exercise their faith without interruption.
It's not too many steps from there to "convert or die."
Many religions, including Christianity, have a violent period in their history when evangelism looked a lot like open warfare, even masacre. Too many innocents were given the choice of repenting and/or dying, and many were not even given a choice. Of course today we are much more civilized, right?
Sadly, the bully apostle is still at work, though somewhat less lethal in most cases.
I am all for the free exchange of ideas. I enjoy discussing religious ideas and reading various authors as part of my meditations. I don't mind when I am challenged by an idea I may not agree with for it gives me a chance to listen to God's wisdom.
As a person who is trying to live an authentic life consistent with my values and morals, I have been on the receiving end of some rather unpleasant judgement and proselytizing. I am at a point in my life where I will not back away from a challenge, nor will I return to the energy-sapping shame that I suffered from during much of my life.
But I more offended now when I see others suffering what some have called "Bible abuse" or I have thought of as "Attack of the Pharasees 2011."
This takes so many forms from physical assault to hell-fire sermons to the perverse interpretation of hating the sin but loving the sinner.
Today I was checking my blood pressure at work. Next to the room with the BP machine is an empty room set aside for personal meditation including an accomodation to the many Muslims who work with us and whose faith requires frequent periods of kneeling prayer.
While I admire those who practice their convictions, I was deeply offended by what I saw as a mean-spirited, intolerant assault on Muslims.
On the floor of the room was a pile of Christian tracts from one of the fundamental churches where I live. To me this was no different than a Shia yelling condemnation in a Catholic church service or someone replacing the cross on an altar with a Star of David.
It was crass, disrespectful and just patently offensive. In other words, a direct assault on someone's faith.
This is not the first time I have found and reported such literature, but the first time I saw it in a place specifically set aside for people to exercise their faith without interruption.
It's not too many steps from there to "convert or die."
Friday, December 31, 2010
Creation and Existence
As we close the first decade of the new millenium, it's a good time to write. First I want to let you know that I am still here and doing well, though there have been many personal and job related issues demanding the attention I would rather direct in other ways. I can't guarantee my ongoing availability but will write when I can and feel a calling.
Two things happened recently that prompts the topic at hand. First, a few months ago I took a short road trip vacation to ease my mind. Driving for me is a meditative time - when done correctly. That means finding winding backroads with little traffic that provide a constantly changing picture of creation both natural and human. I appreciate the architecture of both the natural world and humanity's version of creation via homes and towns and churches and roads and barns.
On my final day of exploring the Ohio River Valley through Ohio, W. Virginia, Indiana, Illinois and Kentucky, and after a hearty meal and a side of humanity at a local Waffle House, I noticed an interesting red box on the map along my route - the Creation Museum.
Well, I have to check this out, I decided and made the short drive to the place. Half expecting to see something resembling a large metal barn or factory, I was quite surprised to find a modern archtecturally pleasing complex complete with an intricate garden and a guard directing traffic as he smiled and bid me welcome in a strangely Stepford manner.
I was interested to see how certain people justified their belief in a 6,000 year old planet where dinosaurs and people walked hand in hoof and where all the geological wonders of the planet and astronomical marvels were created by a vary hands on God. And I firmly believe in the signs posted to honor their beliefs. I just don't share them.
Well when I got inside, there was much promise of a creationism marvel, but when I saw the $25 ticket price I balked. I only could spare a few minutes for a quick run through and the price seemed excessive for that purpose. I regretted not seeing the evidence they had chosen to convince me that the Bible contained God's own literal account of creation and that science was a mere deception.
More recently, as I was looking for content for my new Kindle, I happened on a free book written about 130 years ago titled "Bible Myths and their Parallels in other Religions." Considering that much evidence for such a book has been around much longer than 130 years, I began reading it.
I currently finished reading the first chapter concerning the creation stories (you did know there are 2 quite different ones in Genesis?) and it got me re-thinking about the museum again.
First off, I believe that a God that would create a universe billions of years old is far more believable and worthy of worship than one who took 6 days. Second of all, if the creationists are correct, that makes God rather deceptive in that we have been given the intelligence to discover the intricate wonders of creation only to find that our faculties are lying to us. I kone God has a great sense of humor, but not a cruel and sadistic one.
Take just the light of a distant start. We can see in the night sky the light of stars much farther than 6,000 light years away. Now which is easier to believe? That God created that star millions of years ago so that its light is just now reaching us? Or that God created that star only 6,000 years ago and also created the electron stream of light particles between us so that my eyes now would see the light that shouldn't be reaching me for a few more million years yet?
I also remember when my son and I stood at the rim of Crater Lake in souther Oregon. The sign before us told of a mountain thousands of feet higher than the 8,000 feet that is left. And that the top 6,000 feet were blown off in an explosion around 7,700 years ago that far surpased Mt St Helens in power and was likely witnessed by the Klamath tribe.
The interesting thing in the book is that dozens of religion's (eastern, western and new world) creation story is almost identical to the Biblical one. And most of these religions predate the Hebrews significantly. Now I also believe that ancient myths usually have some root in fact. For example flood stories probably coincide with the end of the last ice age and the dramatic rise in sea level.
These creation stories shared remarkable details such as creating man from dust, that woman was the cause of the fall, of a tree of knowledge and immortality, of a paradise and a serpent and even a dragon / cherubim guarding the entrance, and many, many more including a woman named Ivi. BTW, if you think a Cherubim is an angellic being, you might want to read a bit more about them. They are not something you want to meet on a dark night and equating them to a dragon is a reasonable thing to do.
So what event are all these similar creation stories talking about? To me that is the marvelous thing; to try to imagine what a world of cultures and peoples could be really describing. Was there really a paradise where people got along? Where food was provided by God and required no agriculture or hunting or gathering? Was there a time we really could talk to the animals? And was there a real tree with fantastic fruit?
So what do I believe? That the reality of creation is much more complex than we can currently understand. That while Adam and Eve may mythically represent first people, humanity did not descend from only two individuals. And indeed the universe is far older than creationists believe and that I cannot suspend rationality to join creationists in something that, to me, makes almost no difference in my faith. I also cannot believe nor respect a god who consciously and thoroughly deceives his people.
The book also points out that there is a theological quandry tied to the creation story - if man did not actually fall from God's grace in paradise, then why would he need a redeemer in Jesus? The real question is, does it matter? How important is it that Jesus brings Christians the return to God's grace denied us by the actions of Adam and Eve? Christ did so many wonderful, and mundane, things does this one responsibility negate the others?
It also seems like there is a lot of jumping through spiritual hoops (not to mention the millions of dolars to build a state of the art museum) to support the basic assumption that the Bible in inerrant. Of course some need the Bible to be inerrant, to be the 'facts' supporting their beliefs and supporting their actions. It seems an act of desperation akin to an osterich burying its head in the sand. Gone (in the West anyway) are the 'good old days' when heresy could be punished by death.
So whether you believe the universe is 6,000 years old or 6 times 2 or 3 billion years old...
Happy New Year!
Two things happened recently that prompts the topic at hand. First, a few months ago I took a short road trip vacation to ease my mind. Driving for me is a meditative time - when done correctly. That means finding winding backroads with little traffic that provide a constantly changing picture of creation both natural and human. I appreciate the architecture of both the natural world and humanity's version of creation via homes and towns and churches and roads and barns.
On my final day of exploring the Ohio River Valley through Ohio, W. Virginia, Indiana, Illinois and Kentucky, and after a hearty meal and a side of humanity at a local Waffle House, I noticed an interesting red box on the map along my route - the Creation Museum.
Well, I have to check this out, I decided and made the short drive to the place. Half expecting to see something resembling a large metal barn or factory, I was quite surprised to find a modern archtecturally pleasing complex complete with an intricate garden and a guard directing traffic as he smiled and bid me welcome in a strangely Stepford manner.
I was interested to see how certain people justified their belief in a 6,000 year old planet where dinosaurs and people walked hand in hoof and where all the geological wonders of the planet and astronomical marvels were created by a vary hands on God. And I firmly believe in the signs posted to honor their beliefs. I just don't share them.
Well when I got inside, there was much promise of a creationism marvel, but when I saw the $25 ticket price I balked. I only could spare a few minutes for a quick run through and the price seemed excessive for that purpose. I regretted not seeing the evidence they had chosen to convince me that the Bible contained God's own literal account of creation and that science was a mere deception.
More recently, as I was looking for content for my new Kindle, I happened on a free book written about 130 years ago titled "Bible Myths and their Parallels in other Religions." Considering that much evidence for such a book has been around much longer than 130 years, I began reading it.
I currently finished reading the first chapter concerning the creation stories (you did know there are 2 quite different ones in Genesis?) and it got me re-thinking about the museum again.
First off, I believe that a God that would create a universe billions of years old is far more believable and worthy of worship than one who took 6 days. Second of all, if the creationists are correct, that makes God rather deceptive in that we have been given the intelligence to discover the intricate wonders of creation only to find that our faculties are lying to us. I kone God has a great sense of humor, but not a cruel and sadistic one.
Take just the light of a distant start. We can see in the night sky the light of stars much farther than 6,000 light years away. Now which is easier to believe? That God created that star millions of years ago so that its light is just now reaching us? Or that God created that star only 6,000 years ago and also created the electron stream of light particles between us so that my eyes now would see the light that shouldn't be reaching me for a few more million years yet?
I also remember when my son and I stood at the rim of Crater Lake in souther Oregon. The sign before us told of a mountain thousands of feet higher than the 8,000 feet that is left. And that the top 6,000 feet were blown off in an explosion around 7,700 years ago that far surpased Mt St Helens in power and was likely witnessed by the Klamath tribe.
The interesting thing in the book is that dozens of religion's (eastern, western and new world) creation story is almost identical to the Biblical one. And most of these religions predate the Hebrews significantly. Now I also believe that ancient myths usually have some root in fact. For example flood stories probably coincide with the end of the last ice age and the dramatic rise in sea level.
These creation stories shared remarkable details such as creating man from dust, that woman was the cause of the fall, of a tree of knowledge and immortality, of a paradise and a serpent and even a dragon / cherubim guarding the entrance, and many, many more including a woman named Ivi. BTW, if you think a Cherubim is an angellic being, you might want to read a bit more about them. They are not something you want to meet on a dark night and equating them to a dragon is a reasonable thing to do.
So what event are all these similar creation stories talking about? To me that is the marvelous thing; to try to imagine what a world of cultures and peoples could be really describing. Was there really a paradise where people got along? Where food was provided by God and required no agriculture or hunting or gathering? Was there a time we really could talk to the animals? And was there a real tree with fantastic fruit?
So what do I believe? That the reality of creation is much more complex than we can currently understand. That while Adam and Eve may mythically represent first people, humanity did not descend from only two individuals. And indeed the universe is far older than creationists believe and that I cannot suspend rationality to join creationists in something that, to me, makes almost no difference in my faith. I also cannot believe nor respect a god who consciously and thoroughly deceives his people.
The book also points out that there is a theological quandry tied to the creation story - if man did not actually fall from God's grace in paradise, then why would he need a redeemer in Jesus? The real question is, does it matter? How important is it that Jesus brings Christians the return to God's grace denied us by the actions of Adam and Eve? Christ did so many wonderful, and mundane, things does this one responsibility negate the others?
It also seems like there is a lot of jumping through spiritual hoops (not to mention the millions of dolars to build a state of the art museum) to support the basic assumption that the Bible in inerrant. Of course some need the Bible to be inerrant, to be the 'facts' supporting their beliefs and supporting their actions. It seems an act of desperation akin to an osterich burying its head in the sand. Gone (in the West anyway) are the 'good old days' when heresy could be punished by death.
So whether you believe the universe is 6,000 years old or 6 times 2 or 3 billion years old...
Happy New Year!
Labels: creationism
Wednesday, November 25, 2009
Why I Describe Myself as a Gay Christian
Dave left a comment asking why I characterized myself as a gay Christian. It's because for most of my life, nearly 40 years, I thought those two things, being gay and being a Christian were mutually exclusive. I know I'm hardly alone in that thought even with the strides society has made.
Growing up a preachers kid in the 70's, I was deeply ingrained with religion and society's stern disapproval of boys who like other boys. There were two drivers in my life - church and being gay. Both were all consuming, and there seemed no way to reconcile them.
I considered myself a Dr. Jekyll / Mr. Hyde type person - the good Christian, married, elder, teacher and church leader in the light of day and a man who had 'improper' lusts for other men in the darkness of my soul. I thought that not only was God unhappy with what I then thought of as 'sinful' thoughts but even more unhappy that I had no desire to repent of them.
I know now I kinda had them reversed, but it took years of soul searching, prayer and faith crisis to reconcile those two halves of my personna and begin to accept myself as a wonderful gay person who managed to savage his Christian faith.
Once I came to terms with who I was, a gay man using deceit and lies to masquerade as someone else, I worked very hard and built up the tremendous courage to come out. I then saw a real need to reach out to other gay people who have suffered from what some call 'Bible abuse' like I had and rather than bothering to retain their faith, rejected it completely and turned away from anything having to do with God.
This blog is one way I try to do that, to show that it is possible, though not easy, to be both a gay man and have a close relationship with God. It is a witness I give to others struggling the way I did that I don't have to hide in the closet from God or the church. That I can be a proud gay man with healthy relationships and have the acceptance and blessings of a loving, nuturing God. And by identifying myself as a gay Chrisitian on this blog, it is a sign for others who are where I have been that I have weathered the storm.
By the way this is not my sole identity or single place to write. It is focused on one aspect of the whole, the part that I wish to share to those who find me here. Which is why you will find little of my personal or work life mentioned here. Not because they are un-important, or that they are inconsistent with what I say here, but simply because you are here for the very reason I have claimed to be a gay Christian. And maybe others can benefit from my sharing the same road.
It is also a call for understanding from those who would condemn, who equate the term gay with sin, debauchery and God's wrathful judgement, and call for horrid alternatives like celibacy, desperate attempts to change what canot be changed or the closet in the name of God.
There was a day in my 30's when God spoke clearly to me perhaps for the first time in my life. He asked, "Why are you ashamed of the wonderful man I have created you to be?" That statement made me come to realize that I was wasting so much energy hiding the real me, pretending to be someone I was not, that I had no energy left to do any of the real work he asked me to do.
So now the oppression of the closet is mostly gone, my self-esteem is growing and my relationship with God and others in my live is honest and happy. One other time I heard God's voice was when God sent his peace to me at 10am, on the Wednesday before Thanksgiving in 2001 and forever drew me from my self-imposed exile in desperation and hopelessness into light and happiness and a renewed spirit.
So just as people who have struggled with and beaten cancer refer to themselves as cancer survivors, I in similar fashion have survived four decades of anguish and trauma to accept myself as a child of God, created proudly by him just as I am so I proudly characterize myself as a gay Christian and hope to provide encouragement to others working through their own reconciliations.
Growing up a preachers kid in the 70's, I was deeply ingrained with religion and society's stern disapproval of boys who like other boys. There were two drivers in my life - church and being gay. Both were all consuming, and there seemed no way to reconcile them.
I considered myself a Dr. Jekyll / Mr. Hyde type person - the good Christian, married, elder, teacher and church leader in the light of day and a man who had 'improper' lusts for other men in the darkness of my soul. I thought that not only was God unhappy with what I then thought of as 'sinful' thoughts but even more unhappy that I had no desire to repent of them.
I know now I kinda had them reversed, but it took years of soul searching, prayer and faith crisis to reconcile those two halves of my personna and begin to accept myself as a wonderful gay person who managed to savage his Christian faith.
Once I came to terms with who I was, a gay man using deceit and lies to masquerade as someone else, I worked very hard and built up the tremendous courage to come out. I then saw a real need to reach out to other gay people who have suffered from what some call 'Bible abuse' like I had and rather than bothering to retain their faith, rejected it completely and turned away from anything having to do with God.
This blog is one way I try to do that, to show that it is possible, though not easy, to be both a gay man and have a close relationship with God. It is a witness I give to others struggling the way I did that I don't have to hide in the closet from God or the church. That I can be a proud gay man with healthy relationships and have the acceptance and blessings of a loving, nuturing God. And by identifying myself as a gay Chrisitian on this blog, it is a sign for others who are where I have been that I have weathered the storm.
By the way this is not my sole identity or single place to write. It is focused on one aspect of the whole, the part that I wish to share to those who find me here. Which is why you will find little of my personal or work life mentioned here. Not because they are un-important, or that they are inconsistent with what I say here, but simply because you are here for the very reason I have claimed to be a gay Christian. And maybe others can benefit from my sharing the same road.
It is also a call for understanding from those who would condemn, who equate the term gay with sin, debauchery and God's wrathful judgement, and call for horrid alternatives like celibacy, desperate attempts to change what canot be changed or the closet in the name of God.
There was a day in my 30's when God spoke clearly to me perhaps for the first time in my life. He asked, "Why are you ashamed of the wonderful man I have created you to be?" That statement made me come to realize that I was wasting so much energy hiding the real me, pretending to be someone I was not, that I had no energy left to do any of the real work he asked me to do.
So now the oppression of the closet is mostly gone, my self-esteem is growing and my relationship with God and others in my live is honest and happy. One other time I heard God's voice was when God sent his peace to me at 10am, on the Wednesday before Thanksgiving in 2001 and forever drew me from my self-imposed exile in desperation and hopelessness into light and happiness and a renewed spirit.
So just as people who have struggled with and beaten cancer refer to themselves as cancer survivors, I in similar fashion have survived four decades of anguish and trauma to accept myself as a child of God, created proudly by him just as I am so I proudly characterize myself as a gay Christian and hope to provide encouragement to others working through their own reconciliations.
Tuesday, November 24, 2009
A response to Anonymous comment on the Sexual Sin entry
I wanted to reply to the comment on my Sexual Sin essay on January 26, 2009, from Anonymous no. 2. First, I thank God for sending you to jostle me and the time in my hectic life to write a response.
Anonymous no. 2 started by saying…
He/she then went on to quote several scriptures. Now one issue I have with people who quote scripture is that for the most part no one is arguing the words that are in the Bible. The discord is in what those words mean to a person. Generally I find scripture quoters presume throwing out scriptures is quite enough to state their / God’s case and change other people’s minds or behavior, assuming the meaning has to be crystal clear.
The soul God gave me doesn’t buy into the whole “God said it, I believe it, that settles it” bumper sticker mentality.
One example of a lack of clarity from my own life was when I told some British co-workers that we would do the conversion at their convenience. When they chuckled I knew we did not share a common interpretation of my words, which were perfectly clear to me. One of them explained that ‘convenience’ in Britain is another word for toilet and they were picturing me doing a computer conversion in their home bathrooms.
The main reason I didn’t quote scriptures is that this is an essay on the sociology of religion, not on scripture. It’s about how people variously interpret scriptures and put their interpretations into practice and how they use that interpretation to judge others. Also I VERY much believe in the power of revelation, which God still speaks to us, not only through the Bible, but more often through those around us whom we interact with (and some of you may remember the fortune cookies LOL). I have studied the Bible since early childhood and am quite familiar with the scriptures Anonymous cites as well as hundreds of others.
Theologians have been trying to understand what the scriptures mean since the earliest writings of Moses and pastors have been struggling to define relevance of words written thousands of years ago to life in modern society. What are healing miracles for 2009? Where did Jesus ascend to since our telescopes can see to the beginnings of our universe?
I also believe without the Holy Spirit of God within our souls to guide and reveal to us, the Bible is so much ink on a page. When you, Anonymous, say I should not concern myself with what others think, am I to assume that you have no use for a pastor interpreting and explaining the Bible? That you do not believe in Bible studies where people discuss what the scriptures mean to them? That personal witness (which is what I claim to be) is worthless for the glory of God? That God has had nothing else to say in the 1800+ years since the Bible was written by men?
So I’m not a big fan of throwing around Bible quotes like rocks at a public stoning. You’ve tossed out several without explaining how you interpret them, as if they are perfectly clear. I also wonder if you have considered how the early Christians fared prior to Paul’s first writings, let alone the Gospels coming along decades later.
For example, since it is a theme of your chosen scriptures, I would ask what your definition of sexual immorality is? I have no doubt it differs from mine, but I suspect it will probably differ from many fellow parishioners. There are numerous Biblical incidents I consider sexually immoral that God seemed to bless or ignore such as Solomon’s 900 wives and Abraham having sex with his concubine to name two. And for the literalists who believe in Adam and Eve, God certainly had to bless a lot of incest to get the human race off the ground.
In reference to 1 Corinthians 6:18, as a male who struggles with his weight, it seems that my eating/exercise habits have far more impact inside my body than anything sexual I have done. I can also guarantee I have never looked at a woman lustfully so we can dismiss Matthew 5:28. Regarding Hebrews 13:4, I never committed adultery with my wife during 20 years of marriage. I have and continue to honor the marriage vows I made to the best of my ability, far, far beyond what is required by any judge or law. Good Christian people have called me a fool for continuing to love, honor and cherish her both financially and emotionally.
As for Romans 1:26-27, you are obviously quoting relatively modern translations as the Bible didn’t put it that way prior to the 1940s. As for Romans 13:13, I am quite in the open about as much of my behavior I feel is proper, certainly as much as the average person. While like most I certainly won’t have sex in public, I will unabashedly give my partner a hug or kiss as well as hold his hand in public.
And if you consider me to lack humility, I suggest you read more of my posts. If I still come across as someone lacking humility who doesn’t defer to God (though not necessarily the Bible), let me know. And speaking of humility, you obviously don’t understand what homosexuality is all about and I recommend getting to really know us and truly learn to love us before you condemn us to hell. Do you really believe it is sinful lust that drives me into the arms of another man? That it’s simply a matter of choosing to live as a heterosexual (been there, done that, didn’t work)? Or simply to deny ourselves the very necessary human intimacy that is essential for our mental and emotional well-being?
The part of your writing that offends me most, though, is when you say I consider myself God. Boy that would sure make my life easier and eliminate the need for me to bother writing this. I have many friends who have turned their backs on God because there was no tolerance for them in their church. Part of the work I am called by God to do is to reach out to those hurt by their church and offer hope and a vision of God as loving and worthy to be worshipped. It is extremely difficult akin to helping a badly wounded animal. They hear words from people like you, Anonymous, and there is nothing but loneliness and despair in them. Do you have any idea how hurtful this is? Is there a bit of compassion in your heart?
I assure you, Anonymous, that simply because I interpret scripture different, that my understanding of God is different, that I am open to discuss my doubts and my faith struggle, I have never claimed to usurp God. I have never claimed to know God’s will other than what he has revealed to me about my own life. That I challenge those certainties others have about what God does or does not actually ‘hate’ does not make me God.
By the way I do have scriptures to back up my beliefs. From the following foremost scripture comes my reconciliation with God who created me just the way I am as his gay son and with others in this world who I have to have the courage to live with. It drives my faith journey, my understanding of God worthy to be loved, my thoughts, my actions, my writing, my life, my compassion and my love. Upon it do I weigh and measure everything written, spoken or revealed.
Luke 12:30-31
Anonymous no. 2 started by saying…
I found it most interesting that you used no scripture to back up your claims, but simply your own opinion. It seems to me that God is not working through you, but you are considering yourself to be God. You should not base your assumptions off of other people's opinions, but off of the Bible.
He/she then went on to quote several scriptures. Now one issue I have with people who quote scripture is that for the most part no one is arguing the words that are in the Bible. The discord is in what those words mean to a person. Generally I find scripture quoters presume throwing out scriptures is quite enough to state their / God’s case and change other people’s minds or behavior, assuming the meaning has to be crystal clear.
The soul God gave me doesn’t buy into the whole “God said it, I believe it, that settles it” bumper sticker mentality.
One example of a lack of clarity from my own life was when I told some British co-workers that we would do the conversion at their convenience. When they chuckled I knew we did not share a common interpretation of my words, which were perfectly clear to me. One of them explained that ‘convenience’ in Britain is another word for toilet and they were picturing me doing a computer conversion in their home bathrooms.
The main reason I didn’t quote scriptures is that this is an essay on the sociology of religion, not on scripture. It’s about how people variously interpret scriptures and put their interpretations into practice and how they use that interpretation to judge others. Also I VERY much believe in the power of revelation, which God still speaks to us, not only through the Bible, but more often through those around us whom we interact with (and some of you may remember the fortune cookies LOL). I have studied the Bible since early childhood and am quite familiar with the scriptures Anonymous cites as well as hundreds of others.
Theologians have been trying to understand what the scriptures mean since the earliest writings of Moses and pastors have been struggling to define relevance of words written thousands of years ago to life in modern society. What are healing miracles for 2009? Where did Jesus ascend to since our telescopes can see to the beginnings of our universe?
I also believe without the Holy Spirit of God within our souls to guide and reveal to us, the Bible is so much ink on a page. When you, Anonymous, say I should not concern myself with what others think, am I to assume that you have no use for a pastor interpreting and explaining the Bible? That you do not believe in Bible studies where people discuss what the scriptures mean to them? That personal witness (which is what I claim to be) is worthless for the glory of God? That God has had nothing else to say in the 1800+ years since the Bible was written by men?
So I’m not a big fan of throwing around Bible quotes like rocks at a public stoning. You’ve tossed out several without explaining how you interpret them, as if they are perfectly clear. I also wonder if you have considered how the early Christians fared prior to Paul’s first writings, let alone the Gospels coming along decades later.
For example, since it is a theme of your chosen scriptures, I would ask what your definition of sexual immorality is? I have no doubt it differs from mine, but I suspect it will probably differ from many fellow parishioners. There are numerous Biblical incidents I consider sexually immoral that God seemed to bless or ignore such as Solomon’s 900 wives and Abraham having sex with his concubine to name two. And for the literalists who believe in Adam and Eve, God certainly had to bless a lot of incest to get the human race off the ground.
In reference to 1 Corinthians 6:18, as a male who struggles with his weight, it seems that my eating/exercise habits have far more impact inside my body than anything sexual I have done. I can also guarantee I have never looked at a woman lustfully so we can dismiss Matthew 5:28. Regarding Hebrews 13:4, I never committed adultery with my wife during 20 years of marriage. I have and continue to honor the marriage vows I made to the best of my ability, far, far beyond what is required by any judge or law. Good Christian people have called me a fool for continuing to love, honor and cherish her both financially and emotionally.
As for Romans 1:26-27, you are obviously quoting relatively modern translations as the Bible didn’t put it that way prior to the 1940s. As for Romans 13:13, I am quite in the open about as much of my behavior I feel is proper, certainly as much as the average person. While like most I certainly won’t have sex in public, I will unabashedly give my partner a hug or kiss as well as hold his hand in public.
And if you consider me to lack humility, I suggest you read more of my posts. If I still come across as someone lacking humility who doesn’t defer to God (though not necessarily the Bible), let me know. And speaking of humility, you obviously don’t understand what homosexuality is all about and I recommend getting to really know us and truly learn to love us before you condemn us to hell. Do you really believe it is sinful lust that drives me into the arms of another man? That it’s simply a matter of choosing to live as a heterosexual (been there, done that, didn’t work)? Or simply to deny ourselves the very necessary human intimacy that is essential for our mental and emotional well-being?
The part of your writing that offends me most, though, is when you say I consider myself God. Boy that would sure make my life easier and eliminate the need for me to bother writing this. I have many friends who have turned their backs on God because there was no tolerance for them in their church. Part of the work I am called by God to do is to reach out to those hurt by their church and offer hope and a vision of God as loving and worthy to be worshipped. It is extremely difficult akin to helping a badly wounded animal. They hear words from people like you, Anonymous, and there is nothing but loneliness and despair in them. Do you have any idea how hurtful this is? Is there a bit of compassion in your heart?
I assure you, Anonymous, that simply because I interpret scripture different, that my understanding of God is different, that I am open to discuss my doubts and my faith struggle, I have never claimed to usurp God. I have never claimed to know God’s will other than what he has revealed to me about my own life. That I challenge those certainties others have about what God does or does not actually ‘hate’ does not make me God.
By the way I do have scriptures to back up my beliefs. From the following foremost scripture comes my reconciliation with God who created me just the way I am as his gay son and with others in this world who I have to have the courage to live with. It drives my faith journey, my understanding of God worthy to be loved, my thoughts, my actions, my writing, my life, my compassion and my love. Upon it do I weigh and measure everything written, spoken or revealed.
Luke 12:30-31
30Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'[f] 31The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'[g]There is no commandment greater than these."
Tuesday, September 29, 2009
Ponderings
From childhood I have studied religion and not just Christianity. To various degrees I have studied the various protestant denominations (fundamentalism to progressive), Catholicism, Mormonism, Buddhism, Islam, Judaism and others including a bit of Zoroastrianism (the first monotheistic religion). I am admittedly an amateur on theology, but I don't think you need to be a theologian or pastor, elder, priest, shaman, etc. to work out ones faith. I try to share some of my insights as well as questions here.
Today I have a few random observations and rhetorical questions based on various faiths' claims. These are intended to provoke thoughts, not necessarily an argument. Explanations are welcome as I am very interested in how people rationalize these apparent inconsistencies.
1) If, as some evangelicals claim, God is willing to send disasters to punish society (the good with the bad) to convince the non-believers of his divine will, why does he seem to be unwilling to take much less drastic, more personal action? Perhaps blowing down just the sinner's houses?
2) God punishing the masses for the sins of the few makes him seem capricious, extremely sadistic as well as vengeful. This doesn't coincide with the message of grace and forgiveness I am udes to.
3) There seems an underlying theme from many televangelists... For the faithful, good fortune is God's blessing and bad fortune is a trial. For the unfaithful, good fortune is God showing grace even to the wicked and bad fortune in punishment.
4) If God is going to eventually dispense divine judgement and retribution, why should we as humans waste energy being punitive to those God has already damned?
5) Biblical inerrancy requires an amazing amout of intervention by God. Just as literal creationism requires an inconceivable amount of detail work (such as not just creating the stars but creating lightwaves from those distant stars moving through space on a path to our eyes). Yet we are to believe that this micromanagement God really doesn't care that much about us as individuals even though the Bible says he does.
I've read some of the Koran lately, randomly picking several dozen passages and a couple of observations came to me.
1) The Jews are really reviled in the Koran. But I can't figure out is they are mad at Jews for not following Mohammed or for not sharing God in the first place.
2) Based on my random sampling, I didn't have to read very far each and every passage before there was a reference to hell or judgement.
So here are but a few of the ponderments that go though my mind at times. Again, if someone can explain any of these in a logical way, I welcome the dialog.
Today I have a few random observations and rhetorical questions based on various faiths' claims. These are intended to provoke thoughts, not necessarily an argument. Explanations are welcome as I am very interested in how people rationalize these apparent inconsistencies.
1) If, as some evangelicals claim, God is willing to send disasters to punish society (the good with the bad) to convince the non-believers of his divine will, why does he seem to be unwilling to take much less drastic, more personal action? Perhaps blowing down just the sinner's houses?
2) God punishing the masses for the sins of the few makes him seem capricious, extremely sadistic as well as vengeful. This doesn't coincide with the message of grace and forgiveness I am udes to.
3) There seems an underlying theme from many televangelists... For the faithful, good fortune is God's blessing and bad fortune is a trial. For the unfaithful, good fortune is God showing grace even to the wicked and bad fortune in punishment.
4) If God is going to eventually dispense divine judgement and retribution, why should we as humans waste energy being punitive to those God has already damned?
5) Biblical inerrancy requires an amazing amout of intervention by God. Just as literal creationism requires an inconceivable amount of detail work (such as not just creating the stars but creating lightwaves from those distant stars moving through space on a path to our eyes). Yet we are to believe that this micromanagement God really doesn't care that much about us as individuals even though the Bible says he does.
I've read some of the Koran lately, randomly picking several dozen passages and a couple of observations came to me.
1) The Jews are really reviled in the Koran. But I can't figure out is they are mad at Jews for not following Mohammed or for not sharing God in the first place.
2) Based on my random sampling, I didn't have to read very far each and every passage before there was a reference to hell or judgement.
So here are but a few of the ponderments that go though my mind at times. Again, if someone can explain any of these in a logical way, I welcome the dialog.
Monday, September 28, 2009
Some Thoughts Around Abortion
Dangerous topic - abortion. First off, I realize that as a male, my opinion is of secondary importance. Second, I am pro-choice in that it's not the government's responsibility to dictate reproductive decisions for anyone.
I also do not support legislation based on religion or morality. I do not accept that an embryo is a person nor is a non-viable fetus. Other than that I don't know, but defer to the people actually involved in the pregnancy.
I prefer we not have abortions, but choose not to criminalize what is already a tough decision. I think the best way to minimize abortions is through truthful sex education, strong promotion of contraceptives including the "morning after" pill and a supportive, non-judgemental attitude toward all women. Stygmatizing women through guilt and fear essentially instills only guilt, rarely motivation.
And where are all the anti-abortionists when it comes to paying for pre-natal care and welcoming and supporting the new mother and child into the community with celebration and open arms. No, it seems to be heaps of scorn no matter what decisions a woman makes.
How do they rationalize that all good things are from God and all bad things are brought upon by the individual? What kind of weak, vengeful, arbitrary monster is the god they portray?
While I do believe from personal experience that God (the nuturing one I believe in) can involve himself in the creation or lack of creation of children (I just have to look at the contortions of coincidence that brought my son into the world), I refuse to leave it totally in his hands. Neither do I let him completely control my car.
I find it frustrating in that many abortion opponents are anti-contraception, against teaching kids the facts about sex in schools, are anti-women's rights, and want to label girls as pure or whores. Many refuse to acknowledge that sex outside of marriage not only exists but can be a blessed thing.
I wondered what would happen if they did manage to reverse Roe v Wade - if they were able to turn back the clock to a time where abortions in many places were illegal. Of course the wealthy would still get safe abortions like they always have. The Republicans would lose a plank in their platform that has produced votes for them. The poor would create larger populations of poverty and die more often.
But I'm sure that's "acceptible" as due punishment for their sins. Society as a whole has to put up with more crime and poverty.
I think more about the children born to mothers who do not want them, to live without a loving and nuturing parent. I think about the women who struggle as they might, cannot support their families, I think of the women put to death by the law whether through unlicensed practitioners or the inaction of doctors to sacrifice a fetus to save a mother. What a cruel insensitive world that would be.
Perhaps their god who cannot stop a woman from having an abortion will bring down a hurricane on everyone for our unwillingness to usurp women's right to make their own decisions. And while he's at it, maybe send another one to North Korean.
I also do not support legislation based on religion or morality. I do not accept that an embryo is a person nor is a non-viable fetus. Other than that I don't know, but defer to the people actually involved in the pregnancy.
I prefer we not have abortions, but choose not to criminalize what is already a tough decision. I think the best way to minimize abortions is through truthful sex education, strong promotion of contraceptives including the "morning after" pill and a supportive, non-judgemental attitude toward all women. Stygmatizing women through guilt and fear essentially instills only guilt, rarely motivation.
And where are all the anti-abortionists when it comes to paying for pre-natal care and welcoming and supporting the new mother and child into the community with celebration and open arms. No, it seems to be heaps of scorn no matter what decisions a woman makes.
How do they rationalize that all good things are from God and all bad things are brought upon by the individual? What kind of weak, vengeful, arbitrary monster is the god they portray?
While I do believe from personal experience that God (the nuturing one I believe in) can involve himself in the creation or lack of creation of children (I just have to look at the contortions of coincidence that brought my son into the world), I refuse to leave it totally in his hands. Neither do I let him completely control my car.
I find it frustrating in that many abortion opponents are anti-contraception, against teaching kids the facts about sex in schools, are anti-women's rights, and want to label girls as pure or whores. Many refuse to acknowledge that sex outside of marriage not only exists but can be a blessed thing.
I wondered what would happen if they did manage to reverse Roe v Wade - if they were able to turn back the clock to a time where abortions in many places were illegal. Of course the wealthy would still get safe abortions like they always have. The Republicans would lose a plank in their platform that has produced votes for them. The poor would create larger populations of poverty and die more often.
But I'm sure that's "acceptible" as due punishment for their sins. Society as a whole has to put up with more crime and poverty.
I think more about the children born to mothers who do not want them, to live without a loving and nuturing parent. I think about the women who struggle as they might, cannot support their families, I think of the women put to death by the law whether through unlicensed practitioners or the inaction of doctors to sacrifice a fetus to save a mother. What a cruel insensitive world that would be.
Perhaps their god who cannot stop a woman from having an abortion will bring down a hurricane on everyone for our unwillingness to usurp women's right to make their own decisions. And while he's at it, maybe send another one to North Korean.
