Truth, Love, Evil & Proclivity
In response to my July 13, 2006 entry, "Truth in Love" wrote...
It sounds to me, as it always does, that when it comes to the subject of being a "gay Christian" the homosexual individual is only willing to interpret Scripture in the light of their proclivity rather than allowing themselves to interpret their proclivity in the light of Scripture.
Deciding what is "right" first and then using scripture to confirm a preconceived ideology is akin to being a god unto one's self.
The Bible's clarity on the subject of homosexual behavior is so unambiguous that only a completely perverted interpretation could justify the things that are routinely pronounced on various "gay Christian" blogs as being truth.
Unconditional love does not equate to unconditional acceptance. This is one of many theological leaps that are used to justify your behavior and your decisions, but the God-honoring truth is far removed from the reality of which you cling to.
Ultimately, you are proposing a beautiful side of evil which will have dire consequences for those you have led astray...
TIL
Of course I do have a response with my naive hope that those TILs out there might at least consider an alternate view. Sadly self-proclaimed keepers of the truth seldom are open to enlightenment and revelation. You can just sign me as Faith Through Doubt.
It sounds to me, as it always does... sounds to me like you are reading our writings from your own proclivity, your own preconcieved notion that homosexuality is evil and condemned by God. Try interpreting it with an open mind. What if God doesn't condemn homosexuality? If you can't even consider that posibility, then you should probably take your closed mind on to other topics. No gay people will listen to you. All things are possible, remember?
You're also coming in at the end of the play, my friend. You weren't witness to when I thought like you. You have never experienced 40 years of thinking God condemns you. You have never experienced what it's like to live with only the false hope you would profess for 40 years. You have never prayed for 40 years and think God was ignoring you. You have never felt condemned for what you are, instead of what you do.
Scipture was made for man not man for the scripture. In fact scripture was written by man, not by God. Be careful that your worship of scripture not cloud God's revelation to you. And by using the word proclivity, I see you have already judged me. Judgement is reserved for God. So be careful about who you claim is taking of a god-like role.
What does your interpretation of scripture offer me? Loneliness. A life without intimacy. A life without the full depth of human love. Oh, sure I could become a priest and dedicate myself to the church. But I believe God calls those people into service and he did not call me to that. And it seem s like it's so easy and even insincere to demand of others what you are unwilling to do yourself.
I could pretend I am straight and enter a loveless marriage and not discomfit the world with my orientation. Wait! I already did that and screwed up several lives in the process not to mention being a pathological liar in the name of being a "good Christian."
As far as deciding what is "right" first, you are correct that evil men will often use scripture to support their purposes. But, I did not decide what was "right". God patiently revealed it to me after decades of resistance on my part. He showed me the truth for my life. God is forefront in my life and I follow only him. I only am here to bear witness to his work in my life.
Yet, not only do evil men use the Bible to prove their preconceived ideologies. Well intentioned people do as well. None of us start with a clean slate. We are taught by our parents, ministers, elders and teachers. We take on their interpretations. We can either embrace those exclusively or open ourselves to new revelation. Regardless, I would challenge everyone, myself included, that they are using scriptures to reinforce their existing beliefs. Scripture was not written to prove us right but to challenge us to open our hearts and minds to God's wisdom.
In fact we do this in all aspects of our lives, not just faith. It's called a scotoma - being blind to those things that don't fit our idea of reality. I know I am influenced by my scotomas and try to challenge them whenever I can. I try not to get too comfortable with ANY interpretation - mine or yours.
The Bible's clarity on the subject of homosexual behavior is so unambiguous that only a completely perverted interpretation could justify the things that are routinely pronounced on various "gay Christian" blogs as being truth. Quote me Paul's words in Greek and repeat that statement.
There are countless "unambiguous" statements in the Bible that are routinely ignored. Have you sold all you have and given it to the poor? (Yeah, I picked an obvious one, but I'm sure if I flipped through the book, I'd quickly have a dozen more.) Or do you, like me and so many others, "re-interpret" that to fit your preconceived ideologies? And if you persist in believing that Sodom was destroyed because of homosexuality, you DEFINITELY have a scotoma.
Unconditional love does not equate to unconditional acceptance True. I have never advocated a blank check, anything goes theology. But grace is built on love, not actions nor acceptance. There are consequences for behavior as there is also forgiveness. But God is unconditionally understanding. He knows my situation better than I do. I put my trust in him and I do not believe he would lead me astray. Yes, I make mistakes. But I believe God prefers to welcome me as a flawed individual rather than condemn me for seeking the love, companionship and human intimacy that every human needs to be healthy. I don't believe God gives us challenges in order to drive us away from his presence and his hope.
the God-honoring truth is far removed from the reality of which you cling to. Other than being derisive, I struggle a bit to understand the theology here. Truth is truth. God is truth. I as a mere human cannot know the full truth. That's why I have to rely on faith. And the faith I have is that God can use me, a flawed vessel "Just As I Am" to glorify his kingdom. Perhaps you mean only "perfect" people do God honor and everyone else sullies him.
...propose a beautiful side of evil... You consider me evil? You consider what I do evil? You abhor homosexuality that much? Why? I struggle to understand the vitriol expressed by otherwise good Christians. Explain it to me please. I struggle to see how the love my partner and I share compares with using chemical weapons to murder thousands of people, to forcing millions into gas chambers, to incinerating countless lives, to the greed that robs thousands of their pensions, to the imprisonment of people for what they think, to the persecution of children, to denying food, education and health care to millions, to the hatred and greed that fuels all the worlds seemingly infinite forms of injustice. Explain it to me please because I just don't get it.
Or do you just prefer us all to hide in the closet - live a lie. Practice deception. Sounds like you advocate for the father of lies. I reject shame and lies. Traditional religious and societal intolerance has forced people to pretend to be someone they are not which has terrible psychological effects. Those effects have often manifested themselves in unacceptable behavior such as Mark Foley's.
Instead, loving Christians should be encouraging people to be themselves, respected individuals with much to offer and the right to have a fulfilling life. Sure we all have our struggles being the person God would have us be, but we should be picking each other up and offering hope. I am a child of God and live in his loving presence. And the hope, joy and ministry he has blessed me with have brought new life to my desperate soul.
dire consequences... I am constantly surprised by people's views of God as so un-Christ-like. If God punishes me for bringing a message of hope in God to those you have driven away from him with hopelessness and despair... so be it. I cannot worship a Hitlerian form of god who demands blind obedience and would exterminate undesireables while cultivating only those he would deem idea specimens.
I have lived in shame. I have hid my light under a bushel for far too long. Now I let my faith, my hope shine for those who still live in darkness.
Remember that Jesus loved the lepers of his day. Which is easier - jumping on the anti-gay bandwagon or standing up for those the mainstream would marginalize? Beware the easy path. My recommendation to you is to let God worry about the truth and you can focus on just being loving.
It sounds to me, as it always does, that when it comes to the subject of being a "gay Christian" the homosexual individual is only willing to interpret Scripture in the light of their proclivity rather than allowing themselves to interpret their proclivity in the light of Scripture.
Deciding what is "right" first and then using scripture to confirm a preconceived ideology is akin to being a god unto one's self.
The Bible's clarity on the subject of homosexual behavior is so unambiguous that only a completely perverted interpretation could justify the things that are routinely pronounced on various "gay Christian" blogs as being truth.
Unconditional love does not equate to unconditional acceptance. This is one of many theological leaps that are used to justify your behavior and your decisions, but the God-honoring truth is far removed from the reality of which you cling to.
Ultimately, you are proposing a beautiful side of evil which will have dire consequences for those you have led astray...
TIL
Of course I do have a response with my naive hope that those TILs out there might at least consider an alternate view. Sadly self-proclaimed keepers of the truth seldom are open to enlightenment and revelation. You can just sign me as Faith Through Doubt.
It sounds to me, as it always does... sounds to me like you are reading our writings from your own proclivity, your own preconcieved notion that homosexuality is evil and condemned by God. Try interpreting it with an open mind. What if God doesn't condemn homosexuality? If you can't even consider that posibility, then you should probably take your closed mind on to other topics. No gay people will listen to you. All things are possible, remember?
You're also coming in at the end of the play, my friend. You weren't witness to when I thought like you. You have never experienced 40 years of thinking God condemns you. You have never experienced what it's like to live with only the false hope you would profess for 40 years. You have never prayed for 40 years and think God was ignoring you. You have never felt condemned for what you are, instead of what you do.
Scipture was made for man not man for the scripture. In fact scripture was written by man, not by God. Be careful that your worship of scripture not cloud God's revelation to you. And by using the word proclivity, I see you have already judged me. Judgement is reserved for God. So be careful about who you claim is taking of a god-like role.
What does your interpretation of scripture offer me? Loneliness. A life without intimacy. A life without the full depth of human love. Oh, sure I could become a priest and dedicate myself to the church. But I believe God calls those people into service and he did not call me to that. And it seem s like it's so easy and even insincere to demand of others what you are unwilling to do yourself.
I could pretend I am straight and enter a loveless marriage and not discomfit the world with my orientation. Wait! I already did that and screwed up several lives in the process not to mention being a pathological liar in the name of being a "good Christian."
As far as deciding what is "right" first, you are correct that evil men will often use scripture to support their purposes. But, I did not decide what was "right". God patiently revealed it to me after decades of resistance on my part. He showed me the truth for my life. God is forefront in my life and I follow only him. I only am here to bear witness to his work in my life.
Yet, not only do evil men use the Bible to prove their preconceived ideologies. Well intentioned people do as well. None of us start with a clean slate. We are taught by our parents, ministers, elders and teachers. We take on their interpretations. We can either embrace those exclusively or open ourselves to new revelation. Regardless, I would challenge everyone, myself included, that they are using scriptures to reinforce their existing beliefs. Scripture was not written to prove us right but to challenge us to open our hearts and minds to God's wisdom.
In fact we do this in all aspects of our lives, not just faith. It's called a scotoma - being blind to those things that don't fit our idea of reality. I know I am influenced by my scotomas and try to challenge them whenever I can. I try not to get too comfortable with ANY interpretation - mine or yours.
The Bible's clarity on the subject of homosexual behavior is so unambiguous that only a completely perverted interpretation could justify the things that are routinely pronounced on various "gay Christian" blogs as being truth. Quote me Paul's words in Greek and repeat that statement.
There are countless "unambiguous" statements in the Bible that are routinely ignored. Have you sold all you have and given it to the poor? (Yeah, I picked an obvious one, but I'm sure if I flipped through the book, I'd quickly have a dozen more.) Or do you, like me and so many others, "re-interpret" that to fit your preconceived ideologies? And if you persist in believing that Sodom was destroyed because of homosexuality, you DEFINITELY have a scotoma.
Unconditional love does not equate to unconditional acceptance True. I have never advocated a blank check, anything goes theology. But grace is built on love, not actions nor acceptance. There are consequences for behavior as there is also forgiveness. But God is unconditionally understanding. He knows my situation better than I do. I put my trust in him and I do not believe he would lead me astray. Yes, I make mistakes. But I believe God prefers to welcome me as a flawed individual rather than condemn me for seeking the love, companionship and human intimacy that every human needs to be healthy. I don't believe God gives us challenges in order to drive us away from his presence and his hope.
the God-honoring truth is far removed from the reality of which you cling to. Other than being derisive, I struggle a bit to understand the theology here. Truth is truth. God is truth. I as a mere human cannot know the full truth. That's why I have to rely on faith. And the faith I have is that God can use me, a flawed vessel "Just As I Am" to glorify his kingdom. Perhaps you mean only "perfect" people do God honor and everyone else sullies him.
...propose a beautiful side of evil... You consider me evil? You consider what I do evil? You abhor homosexuality that much? Why? I struggle to understand the vitriol expressed by otherwise good Christians. Explain it to me please. I struggle to see how the love my partner and I share compares with using chemical weapons to murder thousands of people, to forcing millions into gas chambers, to incinerating countless lives, to the greed that robs thousands of their pensions, to the imprisonment of people for what they think, to the persecution of children, to denying food, education and health care to millions, to the hatred and greed that fuels all the worlds seemingly infinite forms of injustice. Explain it to me please because I just don't get it.
Or do you just prefer us all to hide in the closet - live a lie. Practice deception. Sounds like you advocate for the father of lies. I reject shame and lies. Traditional religious and societal intolerance has forced people to pretend to be someone they are not which has terrible psychological effects. Those effects have often manifested themselves in unacceptable behavior such as Mark Foley's.
Instead, loving Christians should be encouraging people to be themselves, respected individuals with much to offer and the right to have a fulfilling life. Sure we all have our struggles being the person God would have us be, but we should be picking each other up and offering hope. I am a child of God and live in his loving presence. And the hope, joy and ministry he has blessed me with have brought new life to my desperate soul.
dire consequences... I am constantly surprised by people's views of God as so un-Christ-like. If God punishes me for bringing a message of hope in God to those you have driven away from him with hopelessness and despair... so be it. I cannot worship a Hitlerian form of god who demands blind obedience and would exterminate undesireables while cultivating only those he would deem idea specimens.
I have lived in shame. I have hid my light under a bushel for far too long. Now I let my faith, my hope shine for those who still live in darkness.
Remember that Jesus loved the lepers of his day. Which is easier - jumping on the anti-gay bandwagon or standing up for those the mainstream would marginalize? Beware the easy path. My recommendation to you is to let God worry about the truth and you can focus on just being loving.
posted by Scott | 8:34 AM
16 Comments:
AMEN!!!!
I really appreciate this blog. I came across it searching for answers, as I have been struggling with my faith and homosexuality. My lover recently left me because he felt our relationship was coming between him and God, and it is wrong to be gay. I share your belief that God almighty is a forgiving caring God, and that I was created just the way he wanted me to be, including being gay.
myspace.com/riotproof
I read your blog with an open mind and I honestly read the bible with an open mind. I don't trust pastors or my own opinions or just regular people to give me the scoop on what God does or doesn't approve of. That being said, I have to tell you I still agree with TIL. I'll give you a couple of reasons...like I said, I don't trust people, my own opinions, or just regular people. That only leaves one source..GOD. The only thing I have telling me what He thinks is the bible so I have to settle for that. Reading it with an open mind I can tell you I've never seen homosexuality accepted or tolerated. I have however, seen it condemned and cursed. So I guess I'm just kind of confused what you don't think the same thing since you're obviously a very intelligent person and you say you've got an open mind.
A couple of other things you said struck me as strange as well. 1) you said you didn't like being judged on who you were instead of what you do. That's the whole point of Christianity though isn't it? We're not saved by works (what we do). We're saved by who we accept as our savior...who we are. Eventually He makes us like Him. 2) You justified a gay lifestyle because we do other things that are equally condemned in the bible. I don't see how this makes sense from a logical standpoint. Jesus never said anything about homosexuality...or rape. There are some societies that actually capture their wives and rape them on in order to consumate their relationship. By the reasoning you put forward, these people would be A-OK because there are other things that are talked about that we don't follow as well. I guess I'm just really confused by your points. I'd like to think there's some legitimate logic behind all this. Don't mistake my tone please, I'm not trying to be arrogant or pompous. I just really want to understand your reasoning here because I can't connect the dots.
I just found your blog and I love it. I agree with you about this issue. Love is the most important thing, and trying, after all that, God will be our judge.
I think that those who condemn us or don't accept us are the ones who are leading people away from God. Many stay away because of the judgment from people, not from God. Since God judges all imperfect behaviors as wrong, then why should this one get so much attention. Anyway, keep writing. I enjoy reading your words. I have a blog too.
L
Just found your blog and really appreciate it.
Hope i can found that strength too...
This excellent website truly has all of the information I wanted about this subject and didnít know who to ask.
Here is my blog post celebrity news
There is definately a lot to know about this
subject. I love all of the points you made.
My page ... hasenchat.net
hello!,I love your writing so much! proportion we keep in touch extra approximately your post on AOL?
I need a specialist on this space to resolve my problem.
May be that is you! Looking forward to look you.
Feel free to surf to my homepage ... twitter account
Thanks for the marvelous posting! I genuinely enjoyed reading it, you
are a great author. I will be sure to bookmark your blog and definitely will come
back in the foreseeable future. I want to encourage one to
continue your great job, have a nice weekend!
Also visit my webpage ... my sex games
Hey just wanted to give you a brief heads up and let you know a few of the pictures aren't loading correctly. I'm
not sure why but I think its a linking issue.
I've tried it in two different web browsers and both show the same outcome.
Visit my website: Bux neo
Hmm it appears like your website ate my first comment (it was super long) so
I guess I'll just sum it up what I wrote and say, I'm thoroughly enjoying your blog.
I as well am an aspiring blog blogger but I'm still new to everything. Do you have any points for newbie blog writers? I'd really appreciate
it.
Feel free to visit my webpage - Make Money With PTC Sites
I rarely drop responses, however after reading through some
of the remarks on "Truth, Love, Evil & Proclivity".
I do have a couple of questions for you if it's allright. Could it be simply me or do some of these comments come across like they are written by brain dead folks? :-P And, if you are posting on additional sites, I would like to keep up with you. Could you make a list of all of all your shared pages like your linkedin profile, Facebook page or twitter feed?
Here is my web blog Gafas Oakley
Awesome blog! Do you have any tips and hints for aspiring writers?
I'm planning to start my own site soon but I'm a little lost
on everything. Would you suggest starting with
a free platform like Wordpress or go for a paid option?
There are so many options out there that I'm totally overwhelmed .. Any recommendations? Thanks!
Here is my website; how I make money
Hello would you mind letting me know which web host you're utilizing? I've loaded your blog
in 3 completely different web browsers and I must say this blog loads a lot quicker then most.
Can you recommend a good hosting provider at a honest price?
Thank you, I appreciate it!
my web-site How to correctly detect an aimbot
Nice post. I used to be checking continuously this blog
and I'm impressed! Very useful information specially the closing part :) I care for such info much. I used to be seeking this certain information for a very lengthy time. Thanks and best of luck.
Here is my web site: Read This
I got what you mean , regards for putting up.Woh I am happy to find this website through google.
"You must pray that the way be long, full of adventures and experiences." by Constantine Peter Cavafy.
Also visit my website cs 1.6 aimbot
Post a Comment
<< Home